Hīra-gopī: Before coming to Kṛṣṇa Consciousness, we have done some offences. So, what will happen to that?

Śivarāma Swami: No, before coming to Kṛṣṇa Consciousness, people do not do offences, they may commit sinful activities. They committed sinful activities in so many lifetimes. By chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa, they are all gone. Sinful activities, becoming free from the results of karma is not a problem, those are not considered offences. They are sins and reaction to sins is not as problematic as the reaction to offences. Offences is when you know about Kṛṣṇa consciousness, or you know what is wrong, and you commit it anyway. Or committing offence against devotional activity, especially against the holy name, or against vaiṣṇavas, that becomes an offence. But generally, people do not commit offences. So, they commit sinful activities. But the results of sinful activities, even just by steady practice of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, [they are gone]. When someone commits sinful activity as a devotee, especially when he is initiated, then that becomes an offence in multiple ways. It is guror avajñā, it is offence to the spiritual master, because someone has promised. It is also an offence to the Vaiṣṇavas, so it is sādhu-nindā, it is also present. And ultimately, it is also an offence to Kṛṣṇa, although Kṛṣṇa forgives offences [to Him] easier than He does to guru and vaiṣṇavas.

Hīra-gopī: So, we can chant then.

Śivarāma Swami: Chanting frees one, devotional activities free one from the results of all activities. That is why we have those 10 offences to the Holy Name, so that a devotee should really avoid and be free from those 10 offences. You know, in Western countries people do not know demigods. So, there is either God or there is nothing. So, they do not make that offence to think that Kṛṣṇa is equal to demigods. In India, yes, that is very prevalent. Committing sin on the strength of chanting the holy name, that is again, another thing. And it is not necessarily even a conscious thing. Even unconsciously, one does something that is not right and knows it is not right, but still goes on, ‘Yes, I will chant, I can do that because I am a devotee’. But no, you cannot. Especially, if knowingly, someone commits a sinful activity and thinks, ‘Well, that is alright. By chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa I will become free from that’. So, these 10 offences sometimes are more prevalent in one culture and more in another. You know, one is deciding that one is not going to commit sinful activity, and then to commit again, which is not committing sin on the strength of chanting the holy name, then that again becomes... Once a devotee gives his word, Prabhupāda would say, ‘You have given your word. How can you go back on your word?’ And that is kali-yuga. Kali-yuga means that not only people are dishonest, in other words, that they lie, but they are dishonest like that, saying that, ‘I did not know how serious a commitment it was. Well, I got initiated when I was 18, I was a kid, I did not know what I was doing’. Are you kidding? 18, you can vote, 18, you can, you know, go join the army and you can kill people and you can fight on behalf of your country. You can die just by deciding that you are going to join the army. So, people are certainly responsible for what they do at 18. But some, ‘No.’ So, that is crooked thinking, that is the dishonesty, ‘Well, I did not know what I was doing. I did not know how difficult it was to keep a vow of no illicit sex’. Even sometimes a very common thing, unfortunately, where people say, ‘Well, you know, no illicit sex means no sex outside of marriage’. Prabhupāda never said such a thing. Illicit sex is for anything other than having children, bās, that is what sex is about. Other than that, one is not supposed to indulge. But just like, we do so many things. You know, you are supposed to eat. But because eating is good and is enjoyable, so people then overeat. So similarly, because there is a pleasure in sex life, then they overindulge. They do not use it for what it is meant for. You are supposed to eat, but you are not supposed to overeat, that will kill you. Same thing. When Kṛṣṇa says, ‘kāmo ’smi bharatarṣabha’ [Bhagavad-gītā 7.11], He says, ‘I am sex life’, it is not against religious principles. So that type of sex life is Kṛṣṇa, but another type of sex life is māyā. This type of eating is good for your health, that type of eating is bad for your health. So, knowing how and when, to what degree we do these things. What else?

Hīra-gopī: So, Guru Mahārāja, we are not that much qualified till now and I do not know whether by the end of this life we will be qualified or not. My question is, what is best, having extreme faith in the spiritual master or having extreme faith in Kṛṣṇa?

Śivarāma Swami: Yasya deve parā bhaktir yathā deve tathā gurau [Śvetāśvatara Upaniṣad 6.23]. So, śāstra says and Prabhupāda would quote that verse, ‘One should have equal faith in Kṛṣṇa and guru’. Guru is representative of Kṛṣṇa. Ultimately, Kṛṣṇa is the guru. He is the guru because guru just repeats what Kṛṣṇa says. As soon as you say something different then you are not a guru. But where is Kṛṣṇa? So, we do not see Kṛṣṇa, but we get to see the spiritual master. So that is why he is the representative of Kṛṣṇa.

So, there are many examples. One example is the example of an ambassador of a country. When he is in that country, he is treated like the president of that country or Prime Minister of that country because he is the representative and he actually represents that country. He is not the Prime Minister, he is not the president, but still he is appointed to represent in a country. So, similarly, spiritual masters are appointed, they are appointed to represent.

Hīra-gopī: Because if we have doubt or anything, we can straight away go to the spiritual master and then clear it.

Śivarāma Swami: When you have doubt, you should go to spiritual master and ask. If I have doubt ‘Why does Kṛṣṇa dance with other men’s wives?’ then I should ask. And if I have doubt in spiritual master ‘Why does this happen? They said you did this. May I ask…?’ then you have to ask. Doubts we should clear up. Because what clears up doubts? Knowledge. We should be situated in knowledge and in that way, there will be no doubts. But when they are, then yes, that is our business. And vaiṣṇavas, senior vaiṣṇavas.

Hīra-gopī: So, people like gṛhasthas, like us, when we have a family, what is the best way of prayer, what is the best spiritual activity other than chanting? How should gṛhasthas practice Kṛṣṇa Consciousness?

Śivarāma Swami: Kīrtana is always the most important thing, so, that they should do things together. You know, the children are grown and growing. So, you know, you got Ārādhya growing and Āḍhya has grown. So, morning program that we do in a temple is a version of morning program a family should have. So, adults should have it and children should participate when and where they can. So, ideally, adults get up early. If they go to sleep early, they get up early, try to get up at four o’clock, clean. You have one form of guru-pūjā. So, either Guru-vandanā or Gurvaṣṭaka, but one of the two. So, you chant one of those two and you can do ārati to a picture and then chant, but ārati is not so important, never is important. Arcanā is never as important as chanting. And then those are the prayers and then after that, you chant japa. And then you read together from śāstra. So, those things should be there. You had the deities, right?

Hīra-gopī: We have a picture of Rādhā-Śyāmasundara and we have just Gopāla, small deity. That was since before.

Śivarāma Swami: Okay, that is good.

Hīra-gopī: And we have a picture of Pañca-tattva and Nṛsiṁha.

Śivarāma Swami: It is good. So yes, like that. And those are the things, simple ārati or kīrtana, japa, reading. Morning. Because it depends, if you have got service, to do things, then that is good. If you have to do things then you got to do laundry, so many things and cooking and this and that. But the ideal thing is morning program, evening program. Or if some people have to go to work at five o’clock in the morning, then the most important always is japa.

Then evening program. Like you are saying, you are getting back by 4.30. So, either morning program, either evening program which are made of the same things, although by evening time hopefully you have finished most of the japa. And you know, you get children to participate, that is the best. So, if it is ārati, let them do ārati because they like that.

Hīra-gopī: So, evening Gaura-ārati and Nṛsiṁha-ārati my both kids do, they do evening ārati, we taught them to do. But yes, that reading is missing, reading together is missing because morning also that Gurvaṣṭaka and then followed by Tulasī-ārati, Nṛsiṁha-ārati. This is what we do.

Śivarāma Swami: Yeah, and then you have Tulasī?

Hīra-gopī: Yes, we have.

Śivarāma Swami: Just like in a temple, right after maṅgala-ārati you have Tulasī-pūjā.

Hīra-gopī: Yes, and then Nṛsiṁha-ārati.

Śivarāma Swami: Yes, but you know, for Tulasī you do not have to go through… I mean, you are doing the same ārati, Tulasī-ārati, singing the song and everything?

Hīra-gopī: Yes.

Śivarāma Swami: Just always remember that none of those things are as important as chanting. So, it is always chanting, hearing Bhāgavatam and then come these other worships. So, do not lose out on time for reading because of ārati. Like Haridāsa Ṭhākura, he used to just sit in front of a Tulasī plant and chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. So, there is no mention that he worshiped Tulasī Devī, that he did. Maybe he did, maybe he did not. But he just sat there and chanted Hare Kṛṣṇa, and for Tulasī Devī that is much more valuable, hearing Kṛṣṇa’s names than to receive ārati.

Hīra-gopī: Yes, because that whole process takes approximately 40 minutes in the morning.

Śivarāma Swami: Do not, save your time. It is not that important. Everyone just offers a little water to Tulasī, bās. And they can just go around three times, yāni kāni ca pāpāni [Śrī Tulasī Pradakṣiṇa Mantra], bās.

Hīra-gopī: Yes, that way we can have time to read together.

Śivarāma Swami: Chanting is always the most important, harer nāmaiva kevalam [Caitanya-caritāmṛta, Ādi-līlā, 17.21].

Hīra-gopī: Okay. And what is that one thing which you like when devotees do, you get pleased when devotees do? What is that thing which devotees do and which pleases you? Like, you like devotees doing those things? What are those things?

Śivarāma Swami: When they are advancing in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. And when they are reading Prabhupāda’s books, that is what I like the most. When devotees really know Śrīla Prabhupāda’s books and on the basis of that, they are asking good questions then that is the best thing. I like mango milkshake, I like other things but those are all details, those are not important things. This is important, advancing in spiritual life and becoming pure devotees, that is what is important.

You are going to go? Or you have got something else?

Hīra-gopī: Not now.

Śivarāma Swami: No? Ok.